ALAMOSA — Following the frenzied ending of the 2023 Colorado legislative session, Representative Matthew Martinez (D-62) and Senator Cleave Simpson (R-6) took the Society Hall stage Friday night for another town hall review with a group of about 50 people.

Keith R. Cerny, publisher of the Valley Courier, was asked to step in and moderate the event.

In opening comments, Sen. Simpson spoke first, summarizing the session with what he viewed as a “key point of consideration” for the120-day session that ended on May 8 while the day before the Senate was still on the floor debating bills.

“That hasn’t happened in the Colorado Senate since 1939. It’s a little indicative, from my perspective, of how the session ended,” Simpson said.

Simpson said the session was a “mixed bag” for him with accomplishments in agriculture and natural resources and renewable energy. He also voiced frustration that “lobbyists, special interests and stakeholder groups” were all asking for legislators’ time, starting as early as mid-February.

The middle of the session was focused on gun control and abortion, he said, and a big milestone was negotiating the budget.

What Simpson described as a “disappointing turn” and a “poor approach to public policy” was the 68-page “significant property tax bill” that was introduced, amended, and voted on during the last hours of the session with no time for consideration.

“That was the most frustrating point in my tenure in the Senate. It left me with a bitter taste in my mouth,” he said.

When it was his turn, Rep. Martinez echoed Simpson’s frustrations with a complex property tax bill and not enough time to consider its implications. He voted against it.

Martinez then summarized the notable number of bills he had introduced, all but one that were passed and all but one with bi-partisan support and one that passed with unanimous support.

For those who were interested, Martinez had also printed out hand-outs for the audience detailing his legislation.

Before opening up for participant questions, Cerny complimented the officials for “working across the aisle to get things done for the people of the Valley” and reminded the audience that the two officials on stage were elected by the voters and the expectation that all questions and comments from the audience be respectful.

Much of the town hall was focused on SB23-303, the $2 billion property tax bill that was passed in the last hours the legislature was in session.

That brought up questions about the motivation to rush through a large bill and introduction in the last days of the session negating the representative government.

Both legislators, who voted against the bill, agreed the late notice was problematic. Simpson speculated that the late introduction is “what happens when one party controls the House, Senate and governor’s office — whether it’s Republicans or Democrats.”

Martinez attributed it to a reluctance to have a special session, which can only be called by the governor.

The term “stakeholders” was also brought up by several members of the audience who either questioned its definition or opposed its use.

One member of the audience brought up the gun control legislation. Addressing Martinez, he said, “As a free citizen, I want to know what the heck you guys are doing with the Second Amendment when we all know that you have not amended the Constitution we all live by.”

Martinez explained his votes — which were against two of the bills and for the other two.

The audience member pressed for his definition of due process because “there’s no due process in the bill.”

Simpson interjected that the bill has been challenged in court and found to be constitutional.

“That doesn’t make it right,” the man said.

“It may not make it right but it’s constitutional,” Simpson responded.

The man then brought up an issue from a previous town hall related to the Secretary of State (SOS) sending out ballots to 30,000 voters who were ineligible to vote.

Simpson corrected the man, stating the county clerk and recorders send out ballots, not the Secretary of State and added that they were flyers — not ballots — encouraging people to vote. He acknowledged the SOS made an error in sending out the flyers to voters who were ineligible but stated the flyers were a mass mailing — not targeted — and second notices were sent out informing those who were ineligible.

“That wasn’t reported in the news,” the man said. “It’s very suspicious.”

Liza Maron, a Saguache County Commissioner, asked Simpson how the housing bill — also known as the Land Use bill — ended up.

Simpson said the bill was a priority of the governor, and it brought up concerns on both sides of the aisle about the bill taking away local authority. Martinez echoed Simpson’s concerns, adding that it also didn’t have stipulations requiring augmentation of water used in development.

Both legislators voted against the bill.

Simpson added that, last year, the state had allocated $500 million for affordable housing. How that expenditure is impacting the issue should be weighed before moving forward.

The conversation then transitioned to TABOR when Gary Goodwin asked about the “mechanism” that allows “the government and Governor (Jared) Polis” to “get their hands on tax money” that really belongs to the taxpayers.

Simpson clarified that state statute allows the legislature to figure out the most appropriate way to disperse TABOR money.

“So, what keeps the government from just keeping all that money,” Goodwin asked.

Martinez explained that the state cannot keep money without taxpayer approval via a ballot measure, and Simpson confirmed.

Another member of the audience asked about the urban-rural divide. “Is it getting larger?”

Martinez felt there have been a lot of bills that are urban-centric with not enough thought about how legislation will impact rural areas, but he’s educating his urban colleagues on rural concerns, including a standing invitation to the Valley to become more familiar with rural concerns.

“The urban rural divide is real. It was growing my first two years but the governor’s vote on the reintroduction of wolves drove a stake in that division and made it greater,” Simpson said.

Simpson also said he expects future discussions about the Colorado River water system and state control of noxious weeds to widen the gap even more.

Martinez encouraged participation in testifying before committees on how legislation will impact rural communities as an effective way to increase urban understanding.

Up until that point, the dialogue had been respectful. That changed when an audience member, who did not state his name, stood, and focused on Rep. Martinez.

“Don’t call me a stakeholder. I’m a landowner, not a stakeholder. Senator Simpson, you may call me a constituent. Representative Martinez, you don’t have that authority…I’m removing that from you. You don’t represent me…or my family.

“Just because we own a piece of property in Colorado, that does not give you the right to put an arbitrary monetary amount on what you want to extort from us and… what the person you really represent — Jared Polis — gets to extort…because that’s what it is.

“You stand with people who say that all the problems are my fault because I’m frigging white. This has to end. That’s why you don’t have any authority because I remove that authority from you. And…guess what. This summer, we’re going to become ungovernable.”

“No, we’re not,” said someone from the back of the room.

Simpson stepped in and said, “This is an opportunity to engage and ask questions.”

Interrupting Simpson, the man continued to focus his anger on Rep. Martinez.

“Our needs are not getting met on the local level,” he said. “You go up there and hob nob with people. You don’t represent us. You represent Jared Polis and smooth things over for Adams State.”

Simpson was forced to speak over the individual, who continued to state  that he didn’t want to be called a stakeholder. Simpson said he could be called whatever he wants.

“That’s part of the process,” Simpson said.

He then reminded the man of his ability to watch legislative discussions as they’re happening live on the floor, but the man continued.

The conversation only ended when Cerny interrupted.

“Let’s move on,” Cerny said.

Carol Riggenbach then asked a question about Polis’ influence over Martinez, asking him about his “hope that you can represent us” when Polis directs him and “you representing us goes against what you want.”

Martinez corrected her, saying that Polis does not direct him how to vote.